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E15 could lead to minimum purchase of 4 gallons of conventional (E10) gasoline

GasBuddy Blog -- By now, many of you know that E15 has been approved and may soon make its way to a pump near you. What some of you don't know is that EPA rules may require you to buy at least four gallons of regular (E10) gasoline. First of all, the four gallon requirement would only apply at stations where E15 is sold from the same hose as E10 gasoline. If each grade of gasoline (E10 and E15) has its own hose, there would be no minimum requirement. However, since many stations have just one hose offering various types of gasoline, you may then be required to pump at least 4 gallons of E10 gasoline to mitigate the higher ethanol concentration left behind in the hose should someone buy E15 ahead of you.

The requirement of at least four gallons in...

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Submitted Sep 21, 2012 By: PD

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henryeOH Champion Author Akron Posts:1,081 Points:59,295 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Sep 30, 2012 5:30:15 AM Ignore henryeOH Report Abuse Bunch of baloney
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,632 Points:1,610,495 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Sep 27, 2012 9:03:50 PM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse Krsna: you're right, it is ridiculous. As for EtOH and H2O / CxHy separation, that's not sooooo big, except perhaps in the icy Canadian weather.
KrsnaDragon Champion Author Montreal Posts:2,412 Points:532,275 Joined:Nov 2011	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 11:57:22 PM Ignore KrsnaDragon Report Abuse How ridiculous! I believe ethanol is far too susceptible to phase separation to be used practically as a motor fuel, particularly in blends with an ethanol volume of more than E10. I'm happy to know that at my two (2) favourite stations here in downtown Montréal, the 91-octane Premium grade gasoline contains no ethanol.
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,632 Points:1,610,495 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 9:01:33 PM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse CW: do you actually read the article?
CapriceWagon All-Star Author Washington Posts:944 Points:480,045 Joined:Feb 2008	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 11:06:09 AM Ignore CapriceWagon Report Abuse Wow, this is just fantastic...
Donatelo Champion Author Dayton Posts:1,124 Points:293,545 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 6:09:29 AM Ignore Donatelo Report Abuse food for fuel is not a good idea in the first place. and what if droughts continue. raising gas milage standards would make more sence, we have the technology but it is being held back.
RAK9466 Champion Author Chicago Posts:2,394 Points:1,739,200 Joined:Aug 2001	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 5:54:43 AM Ignore RAK9466 Report Abuse This is just stupid. If E-15 damages engines why are they selling it? My lawnmower gas can is 2 gal. do I need to buy two more so I get 2 gal of E-10? Can I return the unwanted E-15?
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,632 Points:1,610,495 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Sep 26, 2012 2:45:43 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse EtOH never was the right answer (unless one asks the wrong question(s)).
pricewar Champion Author Ogden Posts:1,945 Points:275,215 Joined:Jul 2012	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 9:17:34 PM Ignore pricewar Report Abuse I would say we are getting Hosed
repseng Sophomore Author Twin Cities Posts:165 Points:14,940 Joined:Sep 2012	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 3:33:35 PM Ignore repseng Report Abuse K
slicerette Champion Author South Bend Posts:3,525 Points:541,205 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 9:36:30 AM Ignore slicerette Report Abuse However - while E15 is not mandatory, the EPA is mandating that more ethanol be used in 2013. We, the American Motorists - have been using less gasoline. If Obama's EPA is mandating more ethanol be used in 2013, then we, the American Motorists - may be offered less gasoline and more ethanol in various Ethanol Blends such as E15. Remember, President Obama has already mandated all U.S. Government Flex Fuel Vehicles use E85 blend. This has caused increase U.S. Gov't Fuel usage. Ethanol gives worse mpg. And Obama's United States Agriculture Dept. is giving out grants to your neighborhood gas stations to install these E15 Blender Pumps. Isn't this a special government give away to Big Oil? [Edited by: slicerette at 9/25/2012 12:39:35 PM EST]
DucatiRider Rookie Author Maryland Posts:70 Points:1,200 Joined:Sep 2012	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 7:52:08 AM Ignore DucatiRider Report Abuse So now the gas stations will further dilute our fuel with something that has less energy and is bad for some/most/all engines? Idiocy.
retired23 Sophomore Author Oakland Posts:237 Points:150,405 Joined:Mar 2012	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 6:49:44 AM Ignore retired23 Report Abuse Once again, Patrick DeHaan is showing us his incompetency at understanding the Federal government. The Feds are only ALLOWING the dispensing of E15. There is absolutely no mandate that requires any refiner, distributor, or retailer to be forced to add or change over to E15 in their product line. E15 is totally optional. Add to all of this, this years' drought affecting the corn producing regions -- ethanol supplies will become so tight that what comes out of the nozzle at most gas stations will be almost pure oil-based gasoline. Remember, even E10 is not mandatory. The Feds legally bribe the refiners to add ethanol just so the Feds can substantiate their subsidies to the corn farmers who sell the corn for ethanol production. GO ELECTRIC!!! Patrick DeHaan--stick to what you know........
Zeke33 Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,576 Points:1,616,895 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Sep 25, 2012 6:00:05 AM Ignore Zeke33 Report Abuse The EPA has overstepped it's bounds. This is getting ridiculous. Ethanol costs more to produce than straight gasoline. This is just a ploy fostered by the Corn Lobby to increase farm output. It is also a bold step by King Hussein Obummer to bring down the economy in the U.S. to its knees. God help us is he gets re=elected in November
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,632 Points:1,610,495 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 9:12:09 PM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse kill the EtOH in gasoline.
slicerette Champion Author South Bend Posts:3,525 Points:541,205 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 10:25:13 AM Ignore slicerette Report Abuse From the Farm Industry blog "The USDA is accepting applications for federal Rural Energy for America (REAP) funds to help gasoline retailers install blender pumps. This is designed to give consumers choice in the ethanol blends they use. This is the second year that blender pumps have been authorized as part of the REAP program. Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack announced last year that USDA had plans to install 10,000 blender pumps over the next five years." Obama Admin's USDA is paying thousands of gas stations $30,000.00 each to install one of 10,000 E15 blender pumps. [Edited by: slicerette at 9/24/2012 1:28:06 PM EST]
slicerette Champion Author South Bend Posts:3,525 Points:541,205 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 9:50:06 AM Ignore slicerette Report Abuse Please Pres. Obama - Stop EPA higher mandate for more ethanol in 2013 gasoline supply. Stop giving $30,000 to gas stations to install these E15 blender pumps. Stop mandating Federal vehicles use E85 in flex fuel vehicles, they use more gas. We, the American Motorist, are using less gas - BUT Now we have to use more Ethanol? That's why Pres. Obama's EPA and USDA and Dept. of Energy are pushing E15.
tazintally Sophomore Author Tallahassee Posts:191 Points:69,425 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 9:47:46 AM Ignore tazintally Report Abuse Mandating how many gallons we buy. Just make one or two pumps in a station to pump 93 and maybe that would help. Don't know if that is an option.
albert2008 Champion Author Winnipeg Posts:7,357 Points:1,481,985 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 7:06:44 AM Ignore albert2008 Report Abuse plain stupid
Kriesel Rookie Author Twin Cities Posts:15 Points:228,310 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 6:46:46 AM Ignore Kriesel Report Abuse I wonder how much it will be enforced? Does each fueling station have to turn people in for fueling less than 4 gallons? Buy a diesel (car/truck/lawnmower/etc) and you can mitigate this problem very easily...
DucatiRider Rookie Author Maryland Posts:70 Points:1,200 Joined:Sep 2012	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 6:38:17 AM Ignore DucatiRider Report Abuse Too. Much. Government. Vote Libertarian, you won't get this crap.
remay Champion Author Houston Posts:6,968 Points:2,118,365 Joined:May 2006	Message Posted: Sep 24, 2012 3:36:19 AM Ignore remay Report Abuse Guess I will have to buy an electric lawn mower, then. I would hate to pour out 2 gal onto the pavement
NOTSOGRN Champion Author Michigan Posts:2,059 Points:1,512,200 Joined:Dec 2007	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 6:14:59 PM Ignore NOTSOGRN Report Abuse . . Gee did we find out this summer that the Gov. can make you buy what it wants you to buy... 4 Gallons minimum when you need less than 4 gallons makes you a law breaker if you do not pump all 4 gallons...Humm...this is just the start what will be next that we will be forced to buy...
Varaxis Rookie Author Riverside Posts:3 Points:810 Joined:May 2012	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 5:49:39 PM Ignore Varaxis Report Abuse Oh, haha. I come back and check for replies and click on read full story and I see that even I read it wrong. :D It was simple after all, you can't pump less than 4 gallons if you want standard gasoline since E15 was passed, if the standard gasoline is pumped out the same hose that E15 is also pumped out of. "All this information is sure to cause confusion..." :p
Varaxis Rookie Author Riverside Posts:3 Points:810 Joined:May 2012	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 3:07:12 PM Ignore Varaxis Report Abuse Are people reading this wrong? I read it as saying that they are introducing gasoline that has more ethanol in it, maybe to see how it works, though they want to limit the side effects of it, which means you probably can't have a full tank of E15 and have to pump 4 gallons of standard gasoline, so those who don't want E15 for whatever reason, don't suffer the consequences, when they go to pump their non-E15 fuel after someone who pumped E15.
indyjim Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:10,101 Points:2,320,405 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 1:43:04 PM Ignore indyjim Report Abuse Shouldn't be an issue...........there aren't many idiots out there who buy ethanol.
MAC48 Champion Author Dallas Posts:1,549 Points:767,755 Joined:Dec 2006	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:29:30 AM Ignore MAC48 Report Abuse My thoughts per your request PD -- First we need to eliminate the EPA or all of the EPA regulations created during the last ten years. Second we need to end ethanol use as an extender in our gasoline supplies. We can go to butanol or other alcohols with a higher carbon content than ethanol and not have any of these silly problems we now have due to our ethanol use. Third, assuming the first or second suggestion is not followed by the US government, the EPA regulation requiring a minimum purchase of 4 gallons at any station that sells e15 and has one hose pumps should also be required by that same regulation to have a 6 foot by 6 foot sign posted under their fuel price sign telling one and all that this station has a four gallon minimum purchase requirement. That will make it easier for all motorist who value e15 as much a I do to completely avoid all stations that sell e15.
Hypersonic All-Star Author Maryland Posts:962 Points:850,290 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:13:22 AM Ignore Hypersonic Report Abuse Absurd
jamofsocal All-Star Author Los Angeles Posts:943 Points:230,435 Joined:Aug 2012	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:13:14 AM Ignore jamofsocal Report Abuse The intentions are good, but we are not there yet. We still do not have a viable solution to sustainable biofuels because we cannot afford to divert food to fuel production. We need more time to develop ways of extracting the starches from other plants.
goldrose1 Champion Author Cleveland Posts:10,944 Points:1,926,515 Joined:Feb 2005	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:10:23 AM Ignore goldrose1 Report Abuse Repeat article
NavyEOD Champion Author Los Angeles Posts:10,011 Points:2,022,125 Joined:Jul 2007	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:09:54 AM Ignore NavyEOD Report Abuse No corn in my tank.
NorthglennBill Champion Author Denver Posts:7,432 Points:1,473,595 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:07:43 AM Ignore NorthglennBill Report Abuse Even after reading this story for the 3rd day in a row, I still don't like ethanol.
JimVP All-Star Author Chicago Posts:632 Points:154,210 Joined:Sep 2011	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:04:37 AM Ignore JimVP Report Abuse Why not make it illegal to use the same pump unless they can clear the hose of all content before the next customer. This is crazy, but that is our government again neither working or thinking.
divebomber Champion Author Nebraska Posts:6,083 Points:1,813,250 Joined:Jun 2007	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:04:29 AM Ignore divebomber Report Abuse OLD NEWS!
pmanning7843 Champion Author Georgia Posts:1,686 Points:339,190 Joined:Jun 2012	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 10:03:51 AM Ignore pmanning7843 Report Abuse more old news
357revo Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:18,130 Points:2,385,580 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:59:09 AM Ignore 357revo Report Abuse Eliminate E15, ethanol diluting gasoline, and rein in the EPA.
ace07 Champion Author Utah Posts:2,457 Points:663,675 Joined:Sep 2007	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:58:39 AM Ignore ace07 Report Abuse Bad plan. Just more red tape.
muquee Champion Author Harrisburg Posts:2,436 Points:523,320 Joined:Nov 2011	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:56:55 AM Ignore muquee Report Abuse No E15 wanted.
fullauto Champion Author Reading Posts:5,325 Points:1,473,040 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:56:15 AM Ignore fullauto Report Abuse old
TedNC Champion Author North Carolina Posts:1,001 Points:228,770 Joined:May 2011	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:56:13 AM Ignore TedNC Report Abuse repeat
gamalerin Champion Author Tampa Posts:4,757 Points:994,485 Joined:Jul 2010	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:55:31 AM Ignore gamalerin Report Abuse yesterday news.
19sheldon43 Champion Author Los Angeles Posts:3,979 Points:843,010 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:55:22 AM Ignore 19sheldon43 Report Abuse As the space shuttle made it way over calif it passed over two wind fields. The first field it pass over not one blade was revolving, on the 2nd field only a very few propellers were moving. No wonder there is an energy problem
tomok Champion Author Portland Posts:33,045 Points:2,346,485 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:55:01 AM Ignore tomok Report Abuse E15 could lead to minimum purchase of 4 gallons of conventional (E10) gasoline? No Fuel from Food! This is not right, something has to be done to stop this! The EPA is meant to serve the public but is now out of control! BARRY! Whatever the size or shape of the vehicle, Produce and ‘Drive’ vehicles with high MPG, are very safe, reliable, has a ‘reasonable’ cost and a good ‘value’ for the money. The price of fuel at the pump is too high! 12/22/2012!
bicycler Champion Author Ontario Posts:14,815 Points:2,598,445 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:54:20 AM Ignore bicycler Report Abuse Marinedad; Old news but important enough to be retreated
nztyraider Champion Author Nevada Posts:2,273 Points:694,825 Joined:Apr 2009	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:53:36 AM Ignore nztyraider Report Abuse Another old post.
arnerator Champion Author Seattle Posts:8,184 Points:1,618,140 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:52:26 AM Ignore arnerator Report Abuse This is yesterday's story. But I agree with bbreff and nsexy. get rid of Ethanol....NOW !!!!
#1purple All-Star Author Grand Rapids Posts:684 Points:1,437,490 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:51:32 AM Ignore #1purple Report Abuse old news :(
N5EXY Champion Author Austin Posts:5,497 Points:1,511,355 Joined:Jul 2004	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:50:33 AM Ignore N5EXY Report Abuse Old news. Get rid of the subsidy. Also old news. Nobody likes ETOH. Old. So why do we still have it? 43 days until the ejection.
bbreff Champion Author Atlanta Posts:9,853 Points:2,569,390 Joined:Jun 2005	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:50:18 AM Ignore bbreff Report Abuse OLD NEWS A ethanol should be abolished.
methaneman Champion Author Minnesota Posts:2,610 Points:1,285,325 Joined:May 2002	Message Posted: Sep 23, 2012 9:50:16 AM Ignore methaneman Report Abuse Get rid of ethanol.......End of many problems!