GM1954
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:7,950
Points:131,880
Joined:Dec 2004
|
Message Posted: May 2, 2012 9:07:52 AM
"What do you grow corn for if not food or fuel? It's got to be one or the other."
Actually, thousands of chemical and industrial products use derivitives of corn. The use of corn starch is limitless. The pharmaceutical industyry uses corn starch in almost every tablet or capsule they make. I'm surprised no one has complained about all that corn used to make aspirin.
And it doesn't have to be one or the other. One acre of corn produces enough corn to make about 600 gallons of ethanol AND almost two tons of animal feed.
|
krzysiek_ck
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:5,322
Points:728,910
Joined:Apr 2011
|
Message Posted: May 2, 2012 8:45:29 AM
Shockjock1961 wrote: "Now which of the ethanolholics were claiming there were no more ethanol subsidies?"
I see you are still getting confused about differences between tax subsidies and loan guarantee. Yes, there is a difference.
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: May 2, 2012 8:35:02 AM
"The first-of-its-kind effort has a big price tag. Last fall, Abengoa received a $132.4 million loan guarantee from the U.S. Department of Energy"
Now which of the ethanolholics were claiming there were no more ethanol subsidies?
"The government, however, wants to make the investment in the new technology that will benefit America, Robb said. It is a high-risk effort for those on the forefront"
This is short hand for "this is yet another pie in the sky boon doogle that is going to cost the taxpayer big bucks when it fails"
"Abengoa, however, selected Kansas for two primary reasons, Robb said: It is a business friendly state"
In other words, more free tax payer money!!
"The DOE is giving grants to us, Poet"
More free taxpayer money!!
"The program provides an incentive to farmers to grow perennials like switchgrass that aid in biomass production. The government would pay 75 percent of the cost to establish the grasses and farmers would receive a rental payment on the land while enrolled in the program"
EVEN MORE FREE TAXPAYER MONEY!!!!!!
"This is MY article Shocky"
So where's the link?
If this process is so practical and economical, then why does it rely so heavily on taxpayer handouts?
[Edited by: Shockjock1961 at 5/2/2012 11:36:36 AM EST]
|
Penny_Pincher
Veteran Author
Columbus
Posts:435
Points:22,695
Joined:Aug 2005
|
Message Posted: May 2, 2012 8:18:01 AM
What do you grow corn for if not food or fuel? It's got to be one or the other. Well, I guess that they can make plastic out of it now.
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 10:03:56 AM
Waterman66...I am for all types of ethanol, even cellulosic. We have a new plant being built in Kansas. Corn and sugarcane seem to be ideal but I feel like we need to find other sources as well.
[Edited by: gamechanger2011 at 5/1/2012 1:04:22 PM EST]
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:59:55 AM
" A bale of crop stubble is created by a baler which is the type of residue that could be used in the Abengoa Bioenergy Biomass of Kansas cellulosic ethanol plant in Hugoton.
Ethanol plant is big business for area
Abengoa building nation's 1st cellulosic operation by Hugoton.
By Amy Bickel - The Hutchinson News - abickel@hutchnews.com
Turn grass into gas.
Tom Robb touts the plan like any good recruiter. After all, he says, switch grass, along with the crop stubble, could help fuel the nation in an era of higher prices at the pump.
Turning residue to fuel - crop stubble and trash left behind by the combine - an idea in the works by Robb's company, Abengoa - seems simple enough on the plains of Kansas. The state is the nation's breadbasket where long stretches of cropland and grassland spread.
However, it isn't as straightforward in southwest Kansas, a semiarid region of the state, where the Spanish-based company is building what will be one of the nation's first cellulosic ethanol plants.
"This area was the heart of the Dust Bowl," said John Holman, a Kansas State University Research and Extension agronomist based in Garden City. "We need to keep that in mind, this soil that blanketed D.C., what has kept that in control is the residue covering the surface."
Yet, done properly, biomass could create additional value for the area's cropland, he said.
Economic boost
Abengoa deemed southwest Kansas the perfect location when company officials sought out a place to build. Robb searched for months for the perfect spot, touring the cornfields of Iowa, the landscape of Indiana and several other states with the idea of turning crop waste into energy.
Near Hugoton, he said, amid the irrigated cornfields and acres upon acres of wheat, he and other officials stopped their search.
The location was first picked because Abengoa planned a corn ethanol plant alongside the cellulosic component.
As other companies began to explore the initiative, Abengona abandoned the idea of a corn plant and focused on biomass.
In Iowa, ethanol producer Poet and Pioneer's DuPont, plan to have facilities online in 2013.
Abengoa, however, selected Kansas for two primary reasons, Robb said: It is a business friendly state and the amount of biomass available.
Construction crews are working on the site near Hugoton, which Robb expects will be producing ethanol by late 2013 or early 2014. The construction phase over the next two years will create 300 jobs and, eventually, 65 permanent jobs with a projected annual payroll of $5 million.
The first-of-its-kind effort has a big price tag. Last fall, Abengoa received a $132.4 million loan guarantee from the U.S. Department of Energy to develop what is projected to be a more than a $350 million, commercial-scale facility.
The government, however, wants to make the investment in the new technology that will benefit America, Robb said. It is a high-risk effort for those on the forefront, but he compares it to the first corn ethanol plants - a process that had to start somewhere.
If it works, it could help the nation become more energy independent.
"From the government perspective, this is a very solid approach," Robb said. "The DOE is giving grants to us, Poet. It shows it can be done. And once you show it can be done, it is transferable technology. Once you do that, you have deployable technology that people can invest in and the risk is now reduced."
Abengoa has invested more than 15 years into the process, including a demonstration plant in Spain.
Hugoton, the company's first commercial plant, will use about 1,300 tons of crop residue and grass a day.
Recruitment
As plant construction continues, company officials are working to recruit farmers, which could seem daunting in a time of high commodity prices amid an area in an extreme drought.
"One of the things that is hurting right now is we have had this tremendous drought," said water rights consultant and Stevens County Commissioner Gary Baker. "Things out in the field don't look very good."
This area of the state is in its second or third year of drought, he said. If drought continues, it could affect getting biomass product.
Robb and others, however, aren't worried. There is plenty of dryland wheat and irrigated cornfields that have residue and cobs that could be harvested. Farmers with limited irrigation wells might want to try planting switchgrass, a perennial that uses less water than corn.
Six counties around the southwest Kansas plant are enrolled in the U.S. Department of Agriculture's Biomass Crop Assistance Program, Robb said. The program provides an incentive to farmers to grow perennials like switchgrass that aid in biomass production. The government would pay 75 percent of the cost to establish the grasses and farmers would receive a rental payment on the land while enrolled in the program.
Robb said rental payments are based on Conservation Reserve Program rates. The program expires in 2016. Company officials are waiting to see if lawmakers include the program in the next farm bill.
To make roughly 25 million gallons of ethanol a year, the company needs about 160,000 acres of grass or residue, Robb said.
Meanwhile, regarding concerns of taking residue off highly erodible land, Robb says they want to do it correctly.
Robb said some areas in southwest Kansas don't get the biomass breakdown as other soil types, and that residue buildup is becoming excessive.
"We don't want to start another dust bowl," he said. "There is a tremendous amount (of research) that has come in on how we can harvest this stuff and do it in the correct and sustainable manner."
According to K-State, an acre of switchgrass produces 450 gallons of ethanol. It takes several years for switchgrass to reach its full potential.
It might not be as profitable as a center-pivot of corn, but for growers in a declining aquifer, it is another option, Holman said. He estimates a farmer could take about 3 tons of dry matter off one acre, which could earn farmers roughly $180 an acre.
Residue helps reduce wind erosion and keeps in moisture - a necessity in a dry, windy climate like southwest Kansas. However, there still is opportunity to harvest biomass, he said, adding he recommends keeping at least 50 to 60 percent of the residue on the soil surface.
"I think it is an option for a producer who is a continuous corn producer struggling with what to do with all the residue they've grown," Holman said."
This is MY article Shocky...where did you get your quotes from?
|
Waterman66
Champion Author
Colorado
Posts:1,386
Points:491,820
Joined:Apr 2007
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:57:39 AM
I am sorry CG. Cellulosic does not make sense with switchgrass or residues. As quoted from your article, an acre of switchgrass will produce 450 gallons of ethanol. A 200 bu corn crop produces 560 gallons.
Less water for switchgrass. Try again. We have done some studies and it takes more water than corn. Also, 3 tons to the acre will bring in $180 per acre for the producer. Right now quality forages are in excess of $200 per ton, not the $60 they are quoting for the grass. I would sell it for feed at the higher price before selling to ethanol.
As for crop residues. Every ton of residue contains around $40 of nutrients that must be replaced at current fertilizer prices. That doesn't include the cost of cutting and baling the residue. Residues are not trash nor are they as cheap as these people want you to think they are. Find a waste stream that is truely a waste stream an convert it to ethanol.
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:44:19 AM
From GC's link
"As biofuel production develops and expands, it will continue to put pressure on U.S. corn and other feed grain production, exports, livestock feeding, and other domestic uses"
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:42:47 AM
"Bring on the switchgrass!"
The only problem is they still have not found a way to do this in a way that is competitive and economical...
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:23:49 AM
Kado101 said..
What most dont realize is that producing corn for ethanol is energy neutral. If you believe that we need ethanol to reduce foreign imports of crude then we should be producing switch grass for ethanol production..
Bring on the switchgrass!
Turn grass into gas.
"Abengoa, however, selected Kansas for two primary reasons, Robb said: It is a business friendly state and the amount of biomass available."
"Hugoton, the company's first commercial plant, will use about 1,300 tons of crop residue and grass a day.""According to K-State, an acre of switchgrass produces 450 gallons of ethanol. It takes several years for switchgrass to reach its full potential."
[Edited by: gamechanger2011 at 5/1/2012 12:31:02 PM EST]
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 9:19:14 AM
http://www.ers.usda.gov/Briefing/Corn/trade.htm
Waterman66....your link :)
|
Kado101
Sophomore Author
Oklahoma
Posts:230
Points:387,985
Joined:Oct 2008
|
Message Posted: May 1, 2012 7:17:34 AM
What most dont realize is that producing corn for ethanol is energy neutral. If you believe that we need ethanol to reduce foreign imports of crude then we should be producing switch grass for ethanol production..
|
Waterman66
Champion Author
Colorado
Posts:1,386
Points:491,820
Joined:Apr 2007
|
Message Posted: Apr 30, 2012 7:56:22 PM
For the people who think that corn is utilized mostly for human consumption. An extremely small portion of yellow dent corn is used for human consumption. Most plants that utilize corn for food use other varieties than yellow dent. Most prefer white corn such as Frito Lay.
http://www.ers.usda.gov/Briefing/Corn/trade.htm
Japan is the world's largest corn importer by far. While producing almost no coarse grains, Japan is a very large meat producer, so the country is a steady buyer of corn, with attention to quality. In recent years, Japanese imports of corn for livestock feed have stagnated, while imports for industrial use and starch manufacturing have increased. South Korea is the second-largest importer of corn in the world. South Korea is a price-conscious buyer, willing to switch to feed wheat or other coarse grains, and ready to buy corn from the cheapest source. Mexico is a growing importer. While a large corn producer, Mexico processes much of its production of white corn into human food products, but has turned to imported yellow corn and sorghum for livestock feed to support increased meat production.
|
SilverStreaker
Champion Author
Twin Cities
Posts:11,935
Points:2,216,310
Joined:Mar 2006
|
Message Posted: Apr 30, 2012 6:58:12 PM
GM1954, thanks for stopping the real lies!
|
GM1954
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:7,950
Points:131,880
Joined:Dec 2004
|
Message Posted: Apr 30, 2012 2:57:05 PM
"Then you are not paying attention. The Ethanol Apologists' Party Line claims that only low grade corn is used to produce ethanol. That claim is true but it ignores the fact that other consumers of low grade corn get pushed up market into the western standards for human consumption."
Some one has fed you a line. Ethanol produces prefer genetic strains designed for ethanol production. "low grade" corn would simply sell for less, no matter where it goes. You'll have a tough time finding a producer of any product that seeks "low grade" corn. Your theory is illogical.
Again, as the market for corn expanded, US farmers, simply, increased corn production to meet demand. The US remains a surplus producer of grain.
|
GrumpyCat
Champion Author
Alabama
Posts:2,606
Points:788,810
Joined:Jun 2009
|
Message Posted: Apr 30, 2012 11:02:19 AM
"I have not heard anyone who is credible say that corn is not used for food. So, I think your outrage is a little misguided."
Then you are not paying attention. The Ethanol Apologists' Party Line claims that only low grade corn is used to produce ethanol. That claim is true but it ignores the fact that other consumers of low grade corn get pushed up market into the western standards for human consumption.
Also the lower grades are used to feed cattle, which are used to feed humans.
Third world countries are not as picky as to what corn they will eat. They have been pushed out of the market since the price of corn tripled.
|
ned23
Champion Author
Columbus
Posts:3,116
Points:291,440
Joined:Dec 2003
|
Message Posted: Apr 30, 2012 8:33:19 AM
I have not heard anyone who is credible say that corn is not used for food. So, I think your outrage is a little misguided.
|
GM1954
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:7,950
Points:131,880
Joined:Dec 2004
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 3:50:10 PM
"1.When you take a food product out of the food line to make fuel it decreases what we have for food, and at times what we have for feed grain for livestock, which in turns raises the price on the grains we use for human consumption and for feed grain. Lower supply means higher demand which always brings higher prices."
Doesn't work that way. As demand for corn increased, farmers simply grew more corn to meet demand. The US remains a surplus producer of corn. That means some of last years corp is sitting in storage, now, and will be when this years corn is harvested.
"2. The government is subsidizing ethanol which is why it may cost about 30-50 cent less per gallon to buy E85 (if it is available where you live). They are paying the price to the farmer for the grain to make the product. If they take the subsidizing out of it, most of the farmers will go back to growing food products, not fuel products. "
Wrong again. What you are referring to WAS the Volumetric Ethanol Excist Tax Credit. That ended the first of this year. Second, the ethanol producers didn't receive that money, the oil distributors did. Third, that tax credit was an offset on ALL FUEL, not just ethanol. 90% of it went to offset federal road tax on gasoline and diesel purchases.
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 3:44:03 PM
"No meatsack try to keep up your buddy is the one that was lying"
So where was he lying?
|
krzysiek_ck
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:5,322
Points:728,910
Joined:Apr 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 2:40:53 PM
tattoo666TX wrote: "When you take a food product out of the food line to make fuel it decreases what we have for food, and at times what we have for feed grain for livestock, which in turns raises the price on the grains we use for human consumption and for feed grain. Lower supply means higher demand which always brings higher prices."
What is grass-fed beef?
What is distillers grain?
tattoo666TX wrote: "The government is subsidizing ethanol which is why it may cost about 30-50 cent less per gallon to buy E85 (if it is available where you live). They are paying the price to the farmer for the grain to make the product. If they take the subsidizing out of it, most of the farmers will go back to growing food products, not fuel products."
You are able to tell us how much it cost, yet you fail to specify the name of the subsidy. How about you provide "a link to a respected Internet source" to back up your statement.
|
Daurel
Veteran Author
Indiana
Posts:313
Points:32,850
Joined:Jul 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 1:50:19 PM
antiguzzle;Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 11:41:46 AM I'm well aware the subsidy ended. The content in the post was germane to the thread topic. The aggressive response from the "Corn Crew" was expected and emboldening.
*
antiguzzle is the one LYING.
Shockjock1961
So are you spinning to divert attention away for the relevant portions of the article?*
No meatsack try to keep up your buddy is the one that was lying.
|
mr157ifhz
Sophomore Author
Gasbuddy
Posts:155
Points:3,120
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 1:18:53 PM
'When you take a food product out of the food line to make fuel it decreases what we have for food, and at times what we have for feed grain for livestock, which in turns raises the price on the grains we use for human consumption and for feed grain'
tatoo666TX, please look up dried distiller's grain. The US ethanol industry produces enough DDG to be the equivelent in volume of the WORLDS FOURTH largest producer of corn. Fuel (gasoline and diesel) are by FAR the biggest driver of food costs -hasn't this all been covered before?-, not ethanol production.
The only bit of CORN (or it's by-products) I've eaten in the last month has been the sweetener in my salad dressing. I've had some good beef (grass fed) and fish and lots of vegies too (why is the price of those going up? Far as I know, they aren't making ethanol from broccoli)
Why no corn? I mostly don't eat junk food.
-Matt
|
tattoo666TX
Champion Author
Texas
Posts:2,567
Points:344,480
Joined:May 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 12:36:00 PM
1.When you take a food product out of the food line to make fuel it decreases what we have for food, and at times what we have for feed grain for livestock, which in turns raises the price on the grains we use for human consumption and for feed grain. Lower supply means higher demand which always brings higher prices.
2. The government is subsidizing ethanol which is why it may cost about 30-50 cent less per gallon to buy E85 (if it is available where you live). They are paying the price to the farmer for the grain to make the product. If they take the subsidizing out of it, most of the farmers will go back to growing food products, not fuel products.
|
krzysiek_ck
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:5,322
Points:728,910
Joined:Apr 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 29, 2012 9:59:42 AM
Catwatch27 wrote: "ethanol is bad for engines & causes food prices to rise. It also is responsible for government subsidies."
What government subsidies? In what way is ethanol bad for the engines? How does ethanol causing food prices to rise and the gasoline is not?
[Edited by: krzysiek_ck at 4/29/2012 1:00:17 PM EST]
|
antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
Points:20,545
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 28, 2012 1:21:04 PM
Catwatch27 - "ethanol is bad for engines & causes food prices to rise. It also is responsible for government subsidies."
You are correct on all accounts.
|
Catwatch27
Rookie Author
South Carolina
Posts:62
Points:33,235
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 28, 2012 12:39:01 PM
ethanol is bad for engines & causes food prices to rise. It also is responsible for government subsidies.
|
krzysiek_ck
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:5,322
Points:728,910
Joined:Apr 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 28, 2012 7:49:11 AM
gamechanger2011 wrote: "Please don't encourage Shocky to start talking about corn again!"
Why? Let everybody see how foolish his/hers spin is. This is a very good example of ignorance is the bliss.
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: Apr 28, 2012 7:17:48 AM
"Please don't encourage Shocky to start talking about corn again!"
Why GC? Do you not want the truth to be known?
[Edited by: Shockjock1961 at 4/28/2012 10:17:55 AM EST]
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 27, 2012 7:52:38 PM
Please don't encourage Shocky to start talking about corn again!
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: Apr 27, 2012 6:48:04 AM
"So you are the one LYING?"
So are you spinning to divert attention away for the relevant portions of the article?
|
Daurel
Veteran Author
Indiana
Posts:313
Points:32,850
Joined:Jul 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 7:03:54 PM
I'm well aware the subsidy ended. The content in the post was germane to the thread topic. The aggressive response from the "Corn Crew" was expected and emboldening.
.
So you are the one LYING?
Fancy that.
Post gas prices in your area like what this site is intended.
|
ned23
Champion Author
Columbus
Posts:3,116
Points:291,440
Joined:Dec 2003
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 10:40:35 AM
Considering that I live in a corn state, and a lot of our customers are farmers or farm suppliers, I'm making more money with corn ethanol than I would be without it.
|
reb4
Champion Author
Chicago
Posts:19,105
Points:1,822,065
Joined:Sep 2004
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 10:37:07 AM
Anti Guzzle, reference "red herring"
|
antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
Points:20,545
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 8:41:46 AM
I'm well aware the subsidy ended. The content in the post was germane to the thread topic. The aggressive response from the "Corn Crew" was expected and emboldening.
|
ridgerunnerNY
Sophomore Author
Rochester
Posts:128
Points:27,990
Joined:Sep 2008
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 7:45:07 AM
IT's also used for animal consumption, fuel, base stock for plastic and styrofoams, decorative items, building materials, etc.; what's your point???
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 5:24:57 AM
Goldseeker...This was obviously an old article and the poster had no idea that the 45 cent a gallon subsidy ended. Just more proof that the poster doesn't have a clue.
|
Banjoe
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:4,250
Points:614,265
Joined:Apr 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 5:01:45 AM
Corn has quite a history in this part of the world and the action seems to be picking up.
Note that the Pilgrims stole their first batch of corn from the Indians. Not a great way to introduce yourself to your new neighbors but a fascinating part of corn history.
|
goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
Posts:19,545
Points:2,718,815
Joined:Sep 2005
|
Message Posted: Apr 13, 2012 4:15:17 AM
Once again....antiguzzle is "spot off" with his posts. Thanks for fouling the air!
"To ease the pain, Congress threw in a 45-cents-a-gallon subsidy ($6 billion a year); to add another layer of protection, it imposed a tariff on imported ethanol of 54 cents a gallon. That successfully shut off cheap imports, produced more efficiently from sugar cane, principally from Brazil."
Where have you been? That 45 cent subsidy is long gone. 54 cent tariff. Also gone. By the way that tariff went to the US treasury, not ethanol producers. The blenders credit also went to the blenders which in most cases was not ethanol companies..
Cheap imports. Really?
U.S. ethanol exports in 2011 reached a record high partly due to Brazil's need to import more ethanol after a poor harvest of sugarcane—the feedstock for most of Brazil's ethanol—sharply decreased that country's ethanol production. U.S. ethanol exports were 133,000 barrels per day at the end of 2011 compared with about 10,000 barrels per day in early 2010.
[Edited by: goldseeker at 4/13/2012 7:16:23 AM EST]
|
antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
Points:20,545
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 9:31:09 PM
h t t p : / /blogs DOT scientificamerican DOT C O M/plugged-in/2011/10/07/the-u-s-now-uses-more-corn-for-fuel-than-for-feed/
"The U.S. Now Uses More Corn For Fuel Than For Feed"
"For every 10 ears of corn that are grown in the United States today, only 2 are consumed directly by humans as food. The remaining 8 are used in almost equal shares for animal feed and for ethanol. And, for the 12 months from August 2011 to 2012, the U.S. biofuels industry used more corn for fuel than domestic farmers did for livestock feed – a first for the industry. This significant milestone in the shifting balance between crops for food versus fuel shows the impact of government subsidies for the biofuels industry. And, it could represent a tipping point in the conflict between food and fuel demand in the future."
"According to Rabobank’s head of agricultural research, Luke Chandler, this shift in the balance between food and fuel could be the tipping point in world grain markets. China, once able to supply its internal corn demand, currently expects to import (from the U.S.) a few million tons of corn next year. This will likely place additional stress on the United States corn industry, as it will introduce another source of demand (and corresponding market pressures) for the nation’s corn harvests."
"“Eating up just a tenth of the corn crop as recently as 2004, ethanol was turbocharged by legislation in 2005 and 2007 that set specific requirements for its use in gasoline, mandating steep rises from year to year. Yet another government bureaucracy was born to enforce the quotas.
To ease the pain, Congress threw in a 45-cents-a-gallon subsidy ($6 billion a year); to add another layer of protection, it imposed a tariff on imported ethanol of 54 cents a gallon. That successfully shut off cheap imports, produced more efficiently from sugar cane, principally from Brazil.
Here is perhaps the most incredible part: Because of the subsidy, ethanol became cheaper than gasoline, and so we sent 397 million gallons of ethanol overseas last year. America is simultaneously importing costly foreign oil and subsidizing the export of its equivalent.”"
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 7:43:51 PM
He is wrong. #2 dent corn is NOT food grade corn! Many of us have provided links to prove this!
|
RedRider1OK
All-Star Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:943
Points:25,440
Joined:Mar 2008
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 6:55:59 PM
Once again....antiguzzle is "spot on" with his posts. Thanks for the clearing the air!
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 9:51:24 AM
Pitbull1 said...
"What would you expect from a guy who eats #2 field corn and drinks crude oil for dinner! I hear crude oil works as good as prune juice! I guess if your full of $%it you need some way to get rid of it!"
Pitbull...I agree!
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 9:49:49 AM
Non of your articles talk about food grade versus non food grade corn! Find an article that says that #2 field corn is used to make corn chips, tortillas and taco shells!
You seriously need to lay off the mountain dew. All that high fructose corn syrup is affecting your thinking.
|
antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
Points:20,545
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 7:27:36 AM
P.S.
Stop The Lies!
|
antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
Points:20,545
Joined:Mar 2012
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 7:27:06 AM
w w w DOT robinsonlibrary DOT C O M/agriculture/plant/field/corn DOT H T M"About two-thirds of the corn grown in the United States goes into livestock feed. Hogs eat almost half the corn crop. Corn provides the base for many kinds of poultry feeds and dairy feeds. Corn and cornstalks are also made into silage, a fermented livestock feed."
"Americans eat about 45 pounds of corn per person per year. Many kinds of food are made from the kernels. Corn also provides food indirectly, in the form of the meat and meat products that come from animals raised on corn. Corn, in one form or another, makes up more of our diet than any other farm crop."
"Corn may be eaten just as it comes from the ear in succotash, chowder, pudding, popcorn, fritters, parched corn, and as roasted or boiled corn on the cob. Hominy is made by treating the whole grains with lye and washing them carefully. Hominy can then be flavored, rolled out, and toasted to make corn flakes (breakfast cereal). Corn kernels are coarsely ground to make corn meal. Foods made from corn meal include corn bread, cookies, tamales, and waffles."
"Corn refining is the process of separating the kernel into its parts. The basic products of refining are starch, sugar, syrup, and oil. Corn oil is used as a salad oil and cooking oil, and in other food products such as margarine and shortening. Cornstarch is used to thicken puddings, gravies, and sauces. It is also used in such products as candy, chewing gum, and baked goods. Corn syrup, made by heating cornstarch in closed tanks, sweetens many foods and is used as a spread for bread."
"Corn is also used in the manufacture of hundreds of inedible products. Cornstalks are used to make wallboards and certain kinds of paper. Ground cobs can be substituted for cork. Whole corncobs are sometimes burned as fuel. Corncob meal may be used for fertilizer, for cleaning furs, and for polishing metals. Cobs are also an ingredient of furfural, a chemical used in making plastic, nylon, and other industrial products. Corn meal is used in the manufacture of adhesives, cork products, felts, cleaning compounds, and plywoods.tarch, refined from corn meal, is used to stiffen and finish paper, yarns, and fabrics. Starch also plays a part in the manufacture of cosmetics, explosives, electric batteries, and drugs. Corn sugar has uses in leather tanning, rayon and paper manufacturing, and other industries. Corn oil is used in soaps, glycerine, paints, varnishes, and rubber substitutes. Ethyl alcohol, made from corn sugar or syrup, is an important ingredient in smokeless powder, shatterproof glass, synthetic rubber, brake fluids, and plastics. Ethyl alcohol is also used to make the "10% alcohol" gasoline you buy at the gas station (ethanol)."
|
Pitbull1
Veteran Author
Detroit
Posts:395
Points:23,790
Joined:Mar 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 6:45:38 AM
What would you expect from a guy who eats #2 field corn and drinks crude oil for dinner! I hear crude oil works as good as prune juice! I guess if your full of $%it you need some way to get rid of it!
|
rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
Points:3,530,290
Joined:Oct 2002
|
Message Posted: Apr 12, 2012 1:30:45 AM
And shocky, of course, buys field corn because he has a commercial grinder in his kitchen?
Sure, and on the wall behind it is his ownership certificate for the Brooklyn Bridge. LOL!!
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 11, 2012 7:52:11 PM
Shocky...oh my gosh. He was talking about dent corn...not #2 grade, non-food grade dent corn that cattle eat and is used to make ethanol.
[Edited by: gamechanger2011 at 4/11/2012 10:53:55 PM EST]
|
gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
Posts:1,534
Points:54,340
Joined:Jun 2011
|
Message Posted: Apr 11, 2012 7:49:32 PM
rumbleseat. They want to believe that #2 yellow field or dent corn is used to make corn chips and other food products. #2 dent or field corn is not food grade corn. High fructose corn syrup is made out #2 grade field corn. I'm not so sure that we should ever have put high fructose corn syrup into our food supply anyway. It has no nutritional value and is now being linked to many health issues.
Would you please help explain to them about the difference between food grade corn and #2 yellow field corn, which is used to make ethanol.
|
Shockjock1961
Champion Author
Illinois
Posts:20,114
Points:2,184,205
Joined:Apr 2006
|
Message Posted: Apr 11, 2012 7:44:37 PM
"The only way to actually eat it out of the field is to grind it into powder or remove the skin and eat is as hominy"
There you go. Field corn (dent) is edible, unlike what the ethanol shills will have you believe...
|